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Destiny 2 the truth


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#1
wonega

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Ok I figured out why Destiny 2 is such a bland game and it is by design.

Bungie know how to make a great game they showed that in Destiny, so why did they go in such a different direction?

 

I like most came to the conclusion it was because they wanted to better balance crucible and make the game more casual friendly which I still feel is the case but why is it so bland and what was Bungies plan to keep the hardcore playing?

 

The grind in Destiny was for ever better and more powerful weapons and gear, they could put these Guaranteed items at the end of all activities and interesting quests which made the game both fun and rewarding.

 

In Destiny 2 they made every weapon a static roll and pretty much gave you all of them in the first 30hrs while also taking away perks and scaling attributes from gear sets making both bland, uninteresting and unrewarding, they replaced most quests with guarenteed legendary weapons for adventures with tokens.

So I asked the question to myself again why have they done this if they know how to make a great game?

 

The answer is Destiny 2 is not about making a great game but how to best moneterize the game...I know that sounds synical but hear me out.

 

The controvercy over pay to win with in game purchases is something Bungie wanted to avoid by keeping to the idea it's only for cosmetic and consumables, so they made a game that makes the grind all about cosmetic's and consumables with both attached to RNG as much as possible to encourage you to spend  for the completionists amongst us.which is why all the weapons are the same , which is why there are so few quests with awsome weapons to grind for and is why perks and scaling attributes have been removed from gear so they can sell them in eververse without you calling it pay to win.

 

It's also why there are no ghosts to find or Calcified fragments or any other things to collect because they don't want you to grind for anything that they are not selling!

 

You look at their patch notes when they keep coming out, and how they promote each new DLC anything to do with getting weapons will be made easier and anything to do with cosmetics will be what they will push on you to grind for and will attatch them to RNG and tokens as much as they possibly can get away with.

 

In conclusion Destiny 2  design is all about how best moneterize the game rather than making it fun to play and why it will continue to feel bland for most of us while only appealing to those that want to complete there gear collections in which case they will try to steer you towards eververse as much as possible


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#2
Curtivobrady

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you do know you don't have to pay for that stuff right. They give you bright engrams turn them in and hope you get what you want. You knew dlc was on this game



#3
wonega

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dude what are you on about im telling you why the game is bland and will stay bland


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#4
Curtivobrady

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what is bland? the campaign, the adventures, the cruicible, the raid, the raid lair, the public events, the iron banner, the strikes, the nightfall? the new gear?


stay patient I think they will get it back together u see they bringing back the re rollable stuff. Another dlc in a few months



#5
michael6745

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dude what are you on about im telling you why the game is bland and will stay bland

 

What he is on about is your conclusion was that Bungie has monetized Destiny 2 and because of that, they have made the game play bland.

 

Everything that is in Eververse is available just by playing the game and obtaining bright engrams.  I have purchased $40 worth of bridge engrams in Season 1 and 99% of the time, I got minimal stuff.  I was more chasing the Metro Shift shader as that is my base shader.  I think I got one exotic emote from my purchase.  I've gotten two just through game play.

 

I truly believe that Eververse is there for those casuals who don't want to or can't play the hours like me and just want a chance to get stuff. And partially for the hardcores who are going to try to see if they can get that "one" item.

 

Do I think that all ghosts, ships, sparrows, etc should be tied behind a Bright Engram. NO!  They should be available in in game rewards.  Like the WoTM ship.  I know people who ground three raids a week for months trying to get that.  I ground Petra. *evil wink* just to get the Queen's ship and when I got it, I used it.  

 

D2 is bland in a sense we have nothing to grind for like the ships and such.  But I am still having fun playing the game every day.  I'm in no rush to try to complete everything now.  So I'm taking my time.  I'm playing Crucible, which I am enjoying.  It needs tweaking, but it's still fun.  Same with PvE.  

 

Destiny 2 at the core is a very rock solid game.  The game play is phenomenal.  It just needs things to do.  

 

I relate Destiny to an addiction.  I was addicted to playing 5 hours a night.  They took away some of that want for me to play and I went through withdrawals.  Many of the classic symptoms of withdrawal are there.  Mostly anger.  LOL...  But I don't want to be angry anymore. I'm just going to accept the game as it is and enjoy it, knowing they're listening and are going to modify the game so that we're happy again.  But how can you make EVERYONE happy.  Someone is going to complain.  


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#6
Curtivobrady

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^^^ exactly and I agree with everything you said. In fact I think the game would be classic if they just made those adventures CAMPAIGN MISSIONS! it makes no sense like I beat the damn boss or the Osiris boss then I have to do adventures that take place before that fight would have made the story mode more epic. But I still run thru them anyway. I dunno heres hoping the update Tuesday makes rewards beast like they boasting it will. Me personally I cant wait for the new rerollable guns. I think that will make me wanna grind more. But ppl will complain then because you can keep re rolling it yourself. Some of these complaints are like out of this world. I never heard of a game where ppl expect the universe and more like this. starcraft and wow



#7
wonega

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you guys really dont understand my post , go back and read it again.



#8
Vipertec

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 I don't think the game is bland , the campaign is easier than D1 was but I wouldn't use the word bland , and with the release of CoO , I like the game even more , they should of released The Curse of Osiris first it's a much better "campaign" then the Gary story is . I'm not to keen about them reusing Exotics from D1 but at least some of the new ones are interesting.  



#9
sgtcoy

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I keep seeing "be patient, give them time."  Well how many 20 dollar DLC's are you going to purchase in hopes that "Bungie is listening" and will improve this bland game.  He hit the nail on the head.  A lot of the hardcore gaming community is gone to other games.  It's not opinion, it is a fact.  I don't relate this to a increase of great games out there.  The rest of the hardcore gamers will be fans' of the game regardless of what Bungie spits out and nothing will change that.  Instead of beating a dead horse realize that some people will give Bungie time 4 years into this franchise while others see the game as lazy and catering to the millennial generation where you don't have to work hard to get rewards.  

 

It would be easier to be patient for Bungie if you didn't get stuck buying 20 dollar DLC's.  Bottom line is this argument is more relatable to politics.  Your either one side or the other and nobody is going to change your mind.  I'm personally not playing the game or downloading my pre-purchased DLC's until the QOL and improvements are made.  My choice isn't everyone's and vice versa. 


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#10
Curtivobrady

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https://finance.yaho...-223657893.html

 

There ya go. Get to grinding before masterworks tomorrow



#11
Ollie1024

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I relate Destiny to an addiction.  I was addicted to playing 5 hours a night.  They took away some of that want for me to play and I went through withdrawals.  Many of the classic symptoms of withdrawal are there.  Mostly anger.  LOL...  But I don't want to be angry anymore. I'm just going to accept the game as it is and enjoy it, knowing they're listening and are going to modify the game so that we're happy again.  But how can you make EVERYONE happy.  Someone is going to complain.  

 

you pretty much say exactly how i feel about the game, do i belive the game is perfect?? not even near, but i do like the DLC and the direccion that the game is taking so im going to keep playing.



#12
Art of War

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I keep seeing "be patient, give them time."  Well how many 20 dollar DLC's are you going to purchase in hopes that "Bungie is listening" and will improve this bland game.  He hit the nail on the head.  A lot of the hardcore gaming community is gone to other games.  It's not opinion, it is a fact.  I don't relate this to a increase of great games out there.  The rest of the hardcore gamers will be fans' of the game regardless of what Bungie spits out and nothing will change that.  Instead of beating a dead horse realize that some people will give Bungie time 4 years into this franchise while others see the game as lazy and catering to the millennial generation where you don't have to work hard to get rewards.  

 

It would be easier to be patient for Bungie if you didn't get stuck buying 20 dollar DLC's.  Bottom line is this argument is more relatable to politics.  Your either one side or the other and nobody is going to change your mind.  I'm personally not playing the game or downloading my pre-purchased DLC's until the QOL and improvements are made.  My choice isn't everyone's and vice versa. 

 

^ This...100% agree.



#13
michael6745

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---  Edited content.  Removed post---

 

I'm not sure if anyone read my comment I made in this post.  If so, I still believe in what I said, but I don't believe it beneficial to this community.  

 

Destiny 2 is not a perfect game.  Bungie tried new things, many of them did not work.  However, I believe that no matter what they do, they'll never make everyone happy.  

 

I believe that Bungie is working to make this game more fun. But as it is, I am having fun doing what I am doing.  Therefore I will keep doing it.  I may play other games from time to time, but we'll see what time has in store for Destiny 2. 



#14
Deltatoast89

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---  Edited content.  Removed post---
 
I'm not sure if anyone read my comment I made in this post.  If so, I still believe in what I said, but I don't believe it beneficial to this community.  
 
Destiny 2 is not a perfect game.  Bungie tried new things, many of them did not work.  However, I believe that no matter what they do, they'll never make everyone happy.  
 
I believe that Bungie is working to make this game more fun. But as it is, I am having fun doing what I am doing.  Therefore I will keep doing it.  I may play other games from time to time, but we'll see what time has in store for Destiny 2.


I’m in the opposite train of thought as you regarding D2. Judging from what I’ve seen thus far, it really seems to me that Bungie has ultimately scaled back the options that we had from D1 just so they can sell them back to us over again and claim that they are fixing the game that they broke in the first place. What we have here is a scaled back, bare bones experience in comparison to even vanilla Destiny 1. The game has its fun points, and I have no shame in admitting that I enjoyed D1 and D2 up until this point. However, with what I’ve seen with this expansion and with D2 in general, it seems to me that in order to get back what we lost from D1, we’ll have to pay for expansion after expansion again just to have a chance of moving forward with this franchise. I know that we did the same thing with Dark Below, House of Wolves and the like but trying the same tactics from D1 again in D2 really left a bad taste in my mouth. Combine that with the lack of subclass options, the minimal additions to the story, the outright retcons to the established lore and the increasing relevance of Eververse (Bungie put up a job listing recently that has said position making Eververse tie more and more into the core experience for crying out loud) and I’ve just had enough. Maybe Bungie will do an about-face and really put their noses to the grindstones but for now, I’m done with Destiny. Period.
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#15
michael6745

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fgwv.gif



#16
Lil'Ubo

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You realize that Bungie is like any other organization, right? Live team is separate from the Design team. Everything that has been "scaled back" were changes made by the Live Team, which works independent from the game design team.

 

Core D2 has been in development since before TTK. All the great improvement after TTK were done by the Live team.

 

Based off what i have heard, these two teams have had a huge blow up when D2 was handed off to the Live team, since it was missing all the features from D1, like private matches, etc.

 

So hopefully it improves. If not, lots of other stuff to do.

 

With respect to microtransactions, it doesn't really effect gameplay. Collecting sparrows and other dumb stuff is OCD that people have. That is your call. 


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#17
wonega

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Nobody seems get the original point I was making in this thread , this is not a thread about casuals v hobbiests or me complaining there are in game purchases, it's a thread trying to explain why I , like most people think Destiny 2 feels so bland compared to Destiny and the reason that won't change.

It's not because they made the game casual friendly but because the hole approach when designing this game is how best to optimize in game purchase rather than making the game fun and rewarding.

You had to do nightfalls, you had to do raids, you had to do exotic bounties, you had to do quests,you had to do iron banner and trails and with random rolls the grind was fun , rewarding and kept you going for months, and if you got all that you could grind your light level for trials and iron banner and chase scaling attributes on gear and the cherry on the cake was cosmetics.

 

now you login for a couple of hours a week and can just join a clan and get free shit or trip over a leaf near a public event and get an exotic, everything to do with power level or weapons they are giving it to you as easly and quickly as possible so they don't matter anymore , your not doing anything to earn any of it, and casuals say yeah they are giving you so much loot it's great!

 

Look at whats missing from this game and look at what they keep showing you, " look guardians at the new Iron Banner Hunter gear...oooh(all weapons bland and power level disabled and no matter how hard you try because RNG your missing one armor peice), "look guardians at the dead orbit faction rally gear and shaders .... gasp"(faction rally ....stand in a circle and shoot stuff and  then go shoot stuff in a cave, all weapons are shitty reskins).

New DLC promotion......."were listening Gaurdians so we are bringing back 3 of coins so you can get those exotic weapons even faster and your fireteam get the same buff so you all get the old exotic weapons from Destiny 1 quicker and were also going to let you buy a thing that will garantee an exotic you haven't got"!

"What's that you say, you want somthing to grind for...... well we are bringing ornaments back ooh look how shiny they are".( corporate Bungie..."you only have a week to go before season 2 starts to get that one missing  armor piece or to get that emote/sparrow/ship you wanted")

 

And in my opinion the reason for all of this is because they don't want you to grind for anything that they are not selling in eververse other than consumables and cosmetics, with their business heads on they are thinking people are more likely to spend money in eververse if they get sick of grinding for it, so in Destiny poo we are missing the cake and grinding for the cherry.

 

It seems to be an on going battle in gaming between the corporation that only cares about how much money they can make and the studios who are trying to make a fun game.


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#18
sgtcoy

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Don't know how to quote on my work computer but to address Lil"Ubo's comment...

 

The game developers started pre TTK.  Ok I can believe that.  At what point during the "developmental stage" did they stop and say, "wow, we're not bringing anything that makes the game better to D2?!?"  I understand thousands of hours go into coding the game.  We get it.  But....  Like I've said before a 100 times, why release a game, that you know is going backwards, in a franchise with loyalists who would see through the cheesiness and lack of content and not expect blowback?  I mean seriously?  They promoted this game "per streams" pointing out all the fun game aspects you could do and it sounded interesting.  But it was all smoke and mirrors.  They tried to get our attention by promoting the cool features like not returning to orbit after being in the tower, Guided Games, and how being in a active clan would improve your gaming experience, all while not bringing over things that were needed and loved.  To many this game introduced a social experience unlike any other game most of us had ever played.  Where at any time during the day or night someone was on in your clan and you could hang out while farming (God rolled weapons-Looking at you Omnigal) or any number of things.  Now after a DLC has dropped, there might be 5 people in our 80 man clan online at 10 pm. on a weekend.

 

So, how many 20 dollar investments will it take JUST to get back to where D1 finished?  Improvements to Y3 Destiny was what was needed.  Instead we will hit year 5/6 and maybe just maybe we will get back to where we left off. 

 

I get that it is a business and making money is priority #1.  But as any business minded individual knows, to keep making money in this industry you have to put out game changing technology/content for consumers to keep coming back and spend their money.  This is a business where advancements are paramount to making money.  If you don't improve you will be dropped for the company who does. 

 

Your right though, if we don't like it, we don't have to play it.  But for people who spent 1800 + hours on D1, its hard to walk away.  Kinda like investing 3 years in a serious relationship with a girl and then just give up on it because of one argument or because she is lazy.  Because if this was just average game, walking away would be easy.  For this reason, believe it or not, people are vocal.  And what does the casual gamer who likes the game as is say, "If you don't like it, play something else."  Kinda fits with the narrative in the world today.  If you don't agree with me then you need to suck it up and go away. 

 

Bungie runs a business, they are not our friends, and they only care/listen if they are put out on front street (xp throttle, end game content stuck behind a paywall, etc.) 


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#19
michael6745

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So, how many 20 dollar investments will it take JUST to get back to where D1 finished?  Improvements to Y3 Destiny was what was needed.  Instead we will hit year 5/6 and maybe just maybe we will get back to where we left off. 

 

 

 

Your right though, if we don't like it, we don't have to play it.  But for people who spent 1800 + hours on D1, its hard to walk away.  Kinda like investing 3 years in a serious relationship with a girl and then just give up on it because of one argument or because she is lazy.  Because if this was just average game, walking away would be easy.  For this reason, believe it or not, people are vocal.  And what does the casual gamer who likes the game as is say, "If you don't like it, play something else."  Kinda fits with the narrative in the world today.  If you don't agree with me then you need to suck it up and go away. 

 

 

My honest opinion. I think before the spring DLC, most of this stuff will be in place.  Bungie knows the community is pissed and exactly why they're pissed.  I think they are going to get most of this implemented quickly.  

 

I am in full agreement on the 1800+ hours.  I put in close to 2000 active  hours in D1 and about 300 dancing hours.  Most of the time I just hung out in PvP and had fun all night. Which is exactly what I am doing in D2.  There are nights, like last night, I just spent a couple hours in game and played around on Mercury.  The game is what I make of it.  It's not perfect, but it takes me away from the stresses of my life and that's all I am looking for.  

 

This is why I'm at a point I'm not going to be upset anymore about the game or what's not there, etc.  It's going to get fixed, I'm still enjoying it as is.  I enjoy my friends I've made and I would prefer to be positive rather than angry over a video game.


Nobody seems get the original point I was making in this thread , this is not a thread about casuals v hobbiests or me complaining there are in game purchases, it's a thread trying to explain why I , like most people think Destiny 2 feels so bland compared to Destiny and the reason that won't change.

It's not because they made the game casual friendly but because the hole approach when designing this game is how best to optimize in game purchase rather than making the game fun and rewarding.

 

 

I thought I did get it.  Your conclusion in your original post was about monetizing the game so everything is behind EV instead of grinding for it.  The thing is, you can get everything in EV by playing the game.   The more you play, the more bright or illuminated engrams you get the more EV stuff you can get.

 

Do I like this process? No.  CoO DLC has more than half of the new items locked behind EV and the bright engrams.  They do need to move much of that out of EV and put things like exotic ghosts behind doing heroic strikes, or things like that.  Make them to have a chance to be directly rewarded for doing the harder things in the game, then we'll do those things.  


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#20
str8upnobs

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My honest opinion. I think before the spring DLC, most of this stuff will be in place.  Bungie knows the community is pissed and exactly why they're pissed.  I think they are going to get most of this implemented quickly.  

 

I am in full agreement on the 1800+ hours.  I put in close to 2000 active  hours in D1 and about 300 dancing hours.  Most of the time I just hung out in PvP and had fun all night. Which is exactly what I am doing in D2.  There are nights, like last night, I just spent a couple hours in game and played around on Mercury.  The game is what I make of it.  It's not perfect, but it takes me away from the stresses of my life and that's all I am looking for.  

 

This is why I'm at a point I'm not going to be upset anymore about the game or what's not there, etc.  It's going to get fixed, I'm still enjoying it as is.  I enjoy my friends I've made and I would prefer to be positive rather than angry over a video game.

 

Well said! Pretty much where I am at too. If I stop enjoying it, and it becomes a stress or boring I go do/play something else. Not a hard concept, but some are having a hell of a time grasping it.

 

Btw: To touch on the whole $ concept that a lot are stuck on also. Yes it is there. But it's kind of like the boogey man. In that it's only scary if you let it be,lol. What I mean by that is it's not a problem unless you make it one by buying the make believe Rolex they're selling.

 

I honestly can say there isn't a thing from season 1 Eververse that I want and don't already have. And other than my week 2 "tip" of $5 , it's all been earned in game. I get why people are upset and don't want games to go down this road, but as I said above. . . It's only scary if you make it scary. Don't feed it and it won't live. /rant


Edited by str8upnobs, 14 December 2017 - 09:16 AM.


#21
Vipertec

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I can see this is going to be a never ending argument , but at least it's been civil so far . I've said it before and I'll say it again , if YOU don't like it , don't play the game , am I totally happy with Destiny 2 , not by a long shot , I am enjoying it the more I play it but there are things I would like changed and they will probably never happen . 

 One thing that needs to be changed for sure is after grinding away on Mercury and not getting any of the CoO armor from Brother Vance really chaps my ass , there aren't as many chest on Mercury and only one place to do a public event , I just like to see the drop rate on the armor upped a little , I may just have to buy it with shards and tokens !! 

 and just to be a pain , if they are bringing back all these D1 Exotics why can't they bring back ICEBREAKER !!! Oh yeah I said it !! 


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#22
michael6745

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 bring back ICEBREAKER !!! Oh yeah I said it !! 

 

 

Squirrel-Nooo.png


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#23
Art of War

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We are all here because we love Destiny 1 and the direction it was headed. The Destiny 2 sequel falls short in many respects to its lofty expectations. It's obvious that some of us are more tolerant and have a reduced set of standards than others. Personally, I have little faith Bungie will make all the changes needed to rekindle the spark sought by many Destiny 1 players.  For example, the Masterworks slot is such a remedial effort to address duplicates and I don't foresee these types of shallow watered-down enhancements being effective in satisfying the majority of the community that are annoyed with the simplified direction of D2.


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#24
R MK XXV

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... bring back ICEBREAKER !!! Oh yeah I said it !! 

 

IF they bring back Icebreaker, its not going to be the same one that you loved in Destiny. 

 

Its main perk.  The perk that made Icebreaker worth using will be completely reworked.  Similar to how they re-released Crest of Alpha Lupe for Titans or Gravaton Forfit for Hunters, but their perks are nothing like their Destiny counterparts.  So you might ask for Icebreaker, but what you receive might be closer to the Hereafter. 

 

Would you really want to do that to Icebreaker?



#25
wonega

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 Really dont get why Michael and str8upnobs in particular (but probably everyone to be honest) dont seem to understand my posts , ill say it again I dont have a problem with Eververse  selling cosmetics and consumables at all, I have never felt like I needed to spend money and I know I can get all that stuff from bright engrams.

My entire post was about explaining why Destiny 2 is BLAND and will stay BLAND because everthing we enjoyed grinding for in Destiny 1 has been removed from destiny 2 , what we are left with is a superficial grind for cosmetics and consumables because these are the only items eververse can sell without people calling it pay to win.(eg:-what where your favourite weapons in Destiny 1 and what was the story behind how you got them?, and what are your favourite weapons in Destiny 2 and what was your story in getting them?)

 

I dont thik you get it or want to get it , you just seem to want to defend a game you like while not engaging in my argument at all.

 

Bungie release news about The Dawning it's all about cosmetics and consumables the only thing related to power or weapons in their blog is a snowball which will probably be the most fun thing to do.


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